TOPIC: Let the addiction begin... Where do i start?

and more...

... and more!

dlatshaw, my best advice is to get ahold of neil. he has the addiction for mercs real bad. lmho. frog

Woo Hoo, Christmas already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bob

Now we just have to find a boat for you to put those on... Been looking , no luck yet

they look funny in someone elses garage.

g3jim wrote:

they look funny in someone elses garage.

Jim,

I'll do my best to take care of them and give them a new home.

I don't think they were too happy in my garage. The first one we took of the truck broke the wood on the stand and fell on my foot! Broke a toe...

Luckily the skeg hit my boot in front of my toes and only the angle on the way up the skeg pressed on my toe.

Always seem to put the steel toes on too late

Oh, and thanks for the reply to my email. I may have more questions as time goes on...

Cheers,

Dan

tim_c wrote:

Now we just have to find a boat for you to put those on... Been looking , no luck yet

I've been looking too. That one you sent me isn't as ugly as some i'm seen. If it'd be longer i'd be tempted more.

I think i'll look for a new power catamaran to fit the bill of "party boat".

As for these two, what about something with a cuddy cabin? 20 or so feet.

Would these two be enough to push it?

You know, If those two girls aren't happy in your garage, they might be better in mine! Along with all those parts! They will look awesome painted up and paired up on a say 20' -22' cuddy cabin. How about the red band style for the cowl wraps too. I'd say they move a boat that size along nicely. And with T&T on both motors, perfect.

Build yourself two stout stands, tilted back about 15 degrees with casters (all four swivel) so you can roll them around the shop, reposition one when working on it for say optimal lighting at the moment, etc. Was one of the best things I did in my many projects on my 1000.

Are the 65's a breaker point set up?

So many cool things to look forward to!! Have fun!

yes Peter same ignition as your 63. These can be modified to the thunderbolt without too much trouble. didn't you try something different with yours?

Are there problems with breaker point? would it be better to switch to thunderbolt?

When it comes time to repaint them is there a source for the decals? Hate to paint around the decals. That always looks bad.

dlatshaw,
No nothing wrong with the breaker point systems from the day. These have a twin ignition set up. Two sets of points, both housed in a single distributor, two coils. Each Point/Coil set fire three of the six cylinders.
They can be tricky to set up but once you have them dialed in the run great. The points are now available new from aftermarket suppliers, so no more scrounging around for New Old Stock (NOS) point/condenser sets.

I understand you can swap in the thunderbolt electronic system fairly easily. The Advantage is a stronger more reliable ignition system that requires far far less maintenance. The disadvantage (in my view) is sourcing all the parts, ensuring they are good parts, etc and I suspect not cheap (but I've never looked into that)

G3,
Yes I am attempting something different. A few years back I started toying around with building a custom ignition system using a Pertonix Points Conversion kit. These are readily available for most any automotive vintage breaker point ignition, but not these old merc's. I've tinkered with it hear and there and actually just recently picked it back up in earnest.

Thanks for the info peter.

Question: why are these two '65 motors different? notice the angle of the frame to the left of the plugs.

On the Ohio motor I changed on of the back cowl supports because the original had a crack in it.

ok, i thought maybe they were different models or something. thanks jim

I've been trying to loosen the pivot on the one motor. I tried applying head with my MAP torch to the pivot area. Also pumped in new grease until some started coming out of the top.

I made it hot enough that the grease that leaked out and the grease on the outside of the pivot housing already turned to liquid. But not enough to fry the paint.

Any other tricks? The motor does not turn on the pivot at all.

On a side note, i ordered a gas tank and fuel line so i can try starting the one. also a new set of ngk plugs and some Sea Foam spray and liquid. Plan on spraying the Sea Foam in through the plug holes and turning the flywheel manually. Try to get it lubed before i run it.

The key to these motors, especially at the start, is patience! There is lots you should do first, all fun fairly simple. Unless Jim has already done all this, I'd recommend:

#1 priority before attempting to starting those motors is to check/replace the water impeller. Just a minute or two running, or repeated short runs (30 seconds), without water can overheat and damage the motor.

Do a compression test to look for stuck rings. Inspect the plugs. Compression and plugs can tell you alot about the health of an engine. Check all the connections for corrosion and clean if needed, Check the fuel pump diaphragms for leaks or splits. Check the carb bowls and clean out any gunk.

I'd also recommend replacing all the fuel lines with new as the old lines (and other vintage rubber parts) may disintegrate quickly as as result of the alcohol in today's fuels.

As for the stuck swivel. After you greased it and heated it, I'd refill with grease and let it sit for some time. If it doesn't move, I'd recommend dissembling it. Again, better than breaking it.

Thanks Peter.

Will any engine compression tester work?

I've rebuilt carbs and swapped transmissions and done brakes, but i never tore apart a motor! I'll probably leave that part to someone else.

I'm confident i can do the carbs and electrical and maybe some seals. So most of your list i'm OK with.

dlatshaw,
You'll want to use a compression gauge that threds into the spark plug hole - not one you try to hold against the hole.
Tilt the beast up and fog all the cylinders as you slowly turn the crankshaft clockwise only until the fogging oil has had a chance to fully coat the cylinder walls.
Then tilt the beast back down and do compression tests with all (6) spark plugs removed.
Although not as critical as with a solid state ignition, I encourage you to put all the spark plugs into their spark plug wires and lay them somewhere against engine ground while doing the compression tests.
Using the ignition key, spin the starter until the gauge quits climbing. Then note that compression reading and go to the nest cylinder.
#6 can be pretty tricky to get a compression gauge into, but if you take the time to remove the lower 'U' shaped cowl and disconnect the rear and front cowl supports at their top cap-screws only, you will be able to sag the lower pan down enough to access #6 cylinder's hole. Just make sure that while all the cowl supports are loose there are no hot 12vdc wires contacting engine ground surfaces.

Another note:
Be careful with how you man-handle the lower pan while attempting to get the swivel to start turning again.
You can ruin the upper motor mounts doing it this way.
I believe the '65 1000 has a steering tongue. This tongue is okay to put a 'cheater pipe' onto to help get the swivel turning AFTER you get the swivel housing very warm with the MAPP gas torch.
Limit your heat to 350-400 degrees F.
Make sure there is no gasoline dripping or present above the area you are heating.
Tilt the Merc up and apply the heat to the under-side of the swivel housing. If you are already getting grease out the top end of the housing, then focus your heat on the bottom 2" on the swivel housing as the bushing (or machined surface - not all have bushings) that can seize against the steering rod, is only about 2" tall.
The rest of the area between the bottom bushing & top bushing is 'over-sized' and not in contact with the ssteering rod.
Once you get the thing turning, tilt the Merc back down and try pumping more grease into the zerk with the Merc facing straight ahead. (this position is where the machined relief in the steering rod is to allow the grease to go to both the upper & lower bushing areas)
Then continue turning the swivel back & forth, ideally both ways until it bumps against the stops.
Continue to turn the swivel until the swivel housing has cooled down to being warm to the touch (100 degrees +/-.
If the swivel gets stiff again as the metals cool down, tilt her up and repeat the process.
This might take as long as a 1/2 hour to an hour to accomplish, but once done you'll be pleased.
Now,...If after all this, the beast still refuses to turn freely, you 'can' tilt the Merc up and drill a hole into the under-side of the lower bushing - until the drill contacts the steel steering rod. (you do not want to drill through the steering rod - just through the aluminum swivel housing).
Then tap the hole with 1/8"NPT, and insert another grease zerk specifically for the lower bushing area.
Then heat the area surrounding the zerk & pump the zerk full of grease. Remember, 1/8"NPT of the zerks are tapered threads, and a 1/8"NPT bottom tap will need to be used since the threads are only going to be 1/8"-3/16" deep before the tap - or zerk - comes in contact with the steering rod.
Keep us posted.

Doc F

Great info there Doc. I have had to do it that way on a couple of motors. It does take some time but it is well worth the effort. Skip.

Doc F

You should write a book! That way i could buy it still post questions here that have been asked before...

Thanks for all the info. I'll keep you posted. most likely will be a weekend hobby. The honey-do list is in full swing...

cheers!

dan

Today i heated and greased. And Heated and tilted and pried on the steering arm. Still not moving.

I need to take it apart i guess?

if you cant get it loose what make you think it will come apart? keep trying.

what i have done in the past is set up an IV drip with PB blaster, i take a grease fitting and drill it out to remove the ball and spring and then attach a plastic hose to that using a clamp or zip tie, then at the other end of the hose i attach a squeeze bottle, i then feed the pb blaster down the tube and try to squeeze some through the grease fitting. If it doesn't work right away pour some blaster into the bottle, tip it upside down and leave and it should gravity feed through. Just be careful if you use your torch, PB blaster is flammable.

another picture

I started the patient on an IV drip of 100ml of SF Deep Creep!

Only time will tell...

As to taking it apart, i read on another forum about a yamaha outboard owner that took his pivot apart and used a press to remove the rod.

Thanks,

da n

I just want to reiterate patience. Repeated heating and cooling cycles will eventually unstick just about anything. Most people don't have the patience though. Repeated tapping with a persuader of some sort may help too. Heavy tool, light hand. Gently....think velvet hammer....apply tension in one direction...tap tap tap....then the other...tap tap tap.

You have a really nice set of twins.

Bernie

Thanks Bernie, i'll try that. I'm in no hurry to get them done, since i don't have a boat for them yet. So patience shouldn't be a problem.

Where should i tap? the bottom of the pivot or the sides of the pivot housing? All of the above?

Tap anywhere you think there ought to be a little clearance. If you have access, tap to move the shaft end to end. If not, think "should this move in this direction?, OK, I'll give it a little help".

Will do. I have a lead hammer that will work quite nicely.

When i press the steering arm it does NOT move. Doesn't even try. Put a 1 inch box end wrench on it and pried, bends the wrench.

Will go back to heat and cool. Still have the IV on it. Will need to get a new zerk...

Anyone know off hand what size zerk is?

So i spent an hour heating and tapping. Attached a cheater bar, think it was a piece of steel conduit, to the steering attachment and pushed the bar so hard it split.

So i continued to heat it and tap it and attached the clamp you see in the picture. I've tightened it so hard that i needed to use the vise grips to continue to tighten it.

I may be making progress. I think it moved 1/16 of an inch... Also heard some popping coming from the steering shaft. Lots of grease leaking out the bottom bushing.

Keep at it, your almost there. It took me about 6 hrs one day of constant heating and pounding on a mount before I had it completely free. If it is starting to move you on the way.

Thanks for the input Skip. Guess i'll have to get back to it.

After you get that one done I have another one you can free up.

HA! I don't think you could pay me enough!

So what freezes these? is it rusted inside? Is the grease just that hard that it holds it in place?

Rust ,lack of grease and mostly poor maintenance.

I like the idea of the clamp to keep presure on the steering arm as you are heating an tapping. As soon as she 'blinks', you'll make fast progress.

Does the other one swivel or is she locked as well.

D. L . : LOnger Leverage .?? If your last pic on the lifting ring chain is your set up (?) I would suggest longer leverage with 2x6 , & 2x4 lumber. . Get a 2x6 thru the transom clamps, & a longer 2 x 4 across the BACK of the pan housing,even sandwich two 2x4 will give the length of the motor leverage... Your wood clamp is very close to the arc bar.... If there is a TENSION bolt on the housing make sure it is loose or remove, add Marvel oil ,or liquid wrench there.
2) We have seen guys with total stuck steering ROD BArs going thru the front of the tube, That get dried grease over time & just like
being submerged in salt water..

Peter,

The other is moving fine. I greased that one and the one on my boat to make sure they stay that way.

Split,

I hung it there so i could get heat to the pivot easily. It normally lives on a stand.

Not sure where you mean to put the 2x4...

Where is the tension bolt?

Thanks for the input!