TOPIC: 1965 65hp water problem. Help

My 67 or so I think it is,#2165005 65hp 4cyl that I have on my Grumman started blowing water out around the #2 spark plug. Nothing in the cylinders and I am hoping its just the gasket on the water jacket. Is this common? can I change it without taking the power head off? I don't see any cracks so I am thinking gasket I hope I hope.
Anybody? Ideas?

That is one HEAVY engine for that boat!! The holeshot must be something to behold, and you would need a gaggle of friends in the bow to stop the porpoising. Anyway to your question, yes it is just a gasket under that cover that can be removed and replaced without exposing the cylinders. The 650 has a blind bore with no separate cylinder head. It can be replaced without removing the powerhead, but I always do anyway to make for a better job. It is hard to clean and check the surfaces for straight otherwise, and it is worth it for the sake of a little extra time and a few more gaskets.

Agreed!

OOPS! sorry its a 67 not a 1965.
Ok where is the best place to get the gaskets ASAP!!

www.marineengine.com/parts/mercury-outboard-parts/650-4-cyl

Thanks Ed, I hope this fix's it. I hate to say it but these Merc's are really beginning to upset me.
Should I use any kind of sealant? what kind?

cosmic12 wrote:

Thanks Ed, I hope this fix's it. I hate to say it but these Merc's are really beginning to upset me.
Should I use any kind of sealant? what kind?

I dare say that any mfr's 51-yr-old motor would have issues by now! It's not like it's a 15-yr-old "plastic" motor like they are now making, where the parts all seize in the plastic and you can't heat 'em up to release 'cause you'll burn it up, and many many parts already obsolete!

Any old motor is gonna require maint and no reason to fret, that's just the way it are! The payback is how cool they look and how nice the old Mercs run when you're done.

Yours looks like a freshwater model and the bolts should come right out. If they don't, be very careful and heat up around the bolts with a propane or MAPP torch.

If the gasket surfaces all look nice'n clean and aren't pitted, you could assemble the gasket dry. If the gasket you get has a shiny glue on it, you definitely don't need anything.

If it's just a plain old uncoated gasket, a little Permatex #3 wouldn't hurt if you desire to use a gasket dressing.

For serious sealing on pitted surfaces, you might have to go with some Ultra-Grey, Ultra-Black, or Hi Temp Red RTV on the inner machined surfaces around the spark plugs.

That's the only place I've ever had any serious erosion issues. The only thing you should ever need on the outer portion of the block is a gasket dressing.

Brush a thin coating of #3 on the bolt threads and they'll never get stuck, either.

Hope that helps, give the ol' gal a break and think some nice thoughts at 'er!...........ed

p.s. I just finished up a 1954 10hp Johnrude that would put motors 30-yrs-newer to shame, as good as it ran. An ugly old thing but mechanically, superb. It's good for another 62 years, now!

Again Thanks Ed, I have just gotten myself frustrated not being able to run any of my 4 boats because of stupid little problems.
I picked up a 58 Feather Craft for a friend 2 weeks ago that has a 58 35hp Johnson that the seller said didn't run and hadn't in over 15yrs but we had to take it if we wanted the hull.
I got it home found a bad float and someone had put the low speed idle needle in wrong, fixed both problems new gas and it runs perfect just unreal how nice it is. That in itself has made me a believer in the J,Rudes. I love the look of Mercs and the sound but that Johnny made me think about what I am doing. My back ground is in I/O or srt8 inboard so this clamp on stuff is very new to me.
Thanks so very much for the help and I will let ya know how it all works out.

OK! well we have success!!! I pulled the cover off and found the gasket rotted around the top 2 plugs, surprise surprise. I glass blasted it and cleaned the head or whats supposed to be the head. After getting all the broken bolts out and I mean all the bolts.
A friend that builds vintage racing sleds gave me some stuff to fill n seal the pit's I put it all back together and oh it runs sweet now. The hole shot is a blast and the cornering is even more fun. I have moved the weight around and have it running very flat. Now I need a SS prop hopping to find a bit more speed. Only running 45/47 on the Phone GPS, was thinking it should be more.
Thoughts?

Sounds pretty fast to me on that boat. Looks like a real hoot!
Good job "staying with" that Merc through the tough times. Looks like it was worth it!

Playing with trim, engine height and props will give you a little more speed, but it seems like you have a good "all rounder" there. Hell of a boat.

Man, that is a cool ride just as it is!! Jack it up and trim up and see I ya get more speed, but 45-47 is kinda fast already on a tin can LOL!! Very beautiful boat!!

Here is 56.2 mph with a Merc 1000!!!

The height seems right, cavitation plate is dead nuts with the bottom and if I trim it up it bounce's like crazy. I had to lower it to the bottom slot to get that out of it. The hole shot is great and it turns on a dime but I just want that magic 50mph mark. I haven't been able to find a prop with the right Hub yet but still looking. Any idea's on size? pitch ect.

Well the now the no start has reared its ugly head. Will not fire at all not even a cough. I have been afraid of removing the Dist. cap because it seems that someone along the line has broken it and glued it back together. For some reason this cap is $125.00 and hard to find any cheaper if ya can find one at all.
Today I start the diagnostics, (just what I want to do on Saturday)
Start with the ole suck squeeze bang n blow I guess and see where I end up.
If anybody has any tips on what these might have as far as usual hick ups let me know please.
Thanks for all the help.

If no sparky. Try removing the harness plug and then crank it with a remote starter switch or pull it over. Disconnect the mercury switch also. Look and I mean really look over that old merc wiring.

Which ignition system do you have?
Your serial group had magnetos and also had solid state.
Please post a picture so we can post the steps to test.
Do you have a stator & rectifier? Some did, and some did not.
doc F

Haven't pulled the cap yet, it is not in the best of shape. Gona wait till I have a new one to put on it. It has a stand alone coil so I assume it has points, I would think being a 67 it wouldn't have electronic ign. but wtf do I know. It defiantly isn't a mag. Anyway I do have spark at the plugs. Seems more fuel related. I took the lines off at the pumps and they are getting and pumping gas. I got it to run today by sucking the gas from the lines/carbs then opened the throttle wide open and blew into the lines, might have moved some crap inside them out but it ran fine for a while then back to no start.
Is there a easy or good way to get to the carbs without having to take the front all apart? Seems the next step is carb over haul.

It would seem that you have the electronic ignition, as they do have a stand-alone ignition coil (the magneto has the ignition coil inside). As Thom states, the "S" models (Starter) has a magneto ignition for 1967, but no battery charging system, and "E" models (Electric Starting) all have the new breaker-less Thunderbolt (battery CD) ignition with the battery charging feature. As also advised, you could have an ignition switch issue, remote control wiring rot (often seen when the remote control is opened-up), or both. Take care when testing not to "blow" the rectifier by operating without the battery being connected at all times (or due to wire rot). Almost all of the time, most all of the wiring inside the cowlings will require repair, and it is very easy to "blow" the ignition module or distributor triggering unit when arcing might occur with rotten wires. I personally am not one that wishes to return to fooling with breaker points from time to time, and the system utilized is very durable until wire rot is an issue. Do yourself a favor and properly repair or replace the wiring first before possibly having to seek ignition components. Yes, the front shroud (behind the front cowl) would be removed to access the carburetors.

Regards,
Joe

Read and believe.
Jos is right on.

After todays efforts I have it nailed down to cold start fuel issue.
All the electrical stuff is good other than the Dist cap that I will replace eventually.
I hear the choke solenoid's clicking but they don't seem to be doing anything. I can take the hat off and use the manual choke and it starts. After running it a bit and its warmed up it will start fairly quick. I need to get in there and see what is missing I guess. Not looking forward to removing the front shroud.

If the cap on a 71 800 is the same I have one that you can have for the shipping if some one knows if it will fit let us know Tim Calms would be a good source for used parts if Joe does not have them

If you can hear the choke clicking, but the chokes don't close, check to see if the choke rod that connects the chokes between carburetors is rubbing against the boot on the coil's wire to the distributor cap, or if the link between the manual choke and the choke rod are fouled, or the cotter pin is hanging up, or,...Perhaps the nuts on the chokes are too snug causing too much friction.
doc

I don't have a clue myself if they are the same maybe someone could tell us and Thank you I would gladly take it if it fits.

I am so confussed. It started right up today, just touched the key and bang!!! off she went. Took it to the beach for some clean up and it started fine 4 more times. (Shaking my head in confusion)

It really sounds like you have poor connections, possibly bad grounds. They all have to be perfect, especially the one(s) from the block to the lower cowl and the starter to the block. Often threads are stripped and bolts loosen creating a poor ground. If you have not repaired the rotted +12v wiring yet you need to do that as well. Replace the distributor cap. Beats paddling back!