TOPIC: Foam Floatation?

professor wrote:

If one went for a dip in the ocean you would find that a smaller pool noodle is all you need to stay afloat.

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Then visit the Dead Sea ( water at 1.24 KG / liter or about 77 LB / cubic foot) and you would find that the water there gives enuff bouyancy and you do not need a pool noodle to stay afloat.

using this logic...no one would ever drowned in the ocean...and ocean going ships would fly...

USCG regs.
www.uscgboating.org/regulations/boatbuilder_s_handbook/flotation_contents.aspx

I'll say this I'm no expert in this. I'm a novice boater. I do plan on taking my Starcraft out into the Great lakes though. So I also have a vested interest in this subject. I also have an 8 yo that loves to fish and boat. Every year people die on Lake St. Clair, nat all from alchohol accident either.

Watching this thread in hopes of learning something. Thanks to nautilis for asking this question. Thanks for all the participants in this discussion too. Sorry for the hi-jack.

From what I read of the USCG reg, there are two modes of flotation, Basic and Level flotation. Interesting, I pick level for me!

From the regulations;

Basic Flotation: A flotation system which will keep a swamped boat from sinking when its passengers are in the water clinging to it, provided that the aggregate weight of the motor, passengers and equipment carried in or attached to the boat does not exceed the boat's maximum weight capacity. With Basic Flotation, the swamped boat may float at any attitude.

Level Flotation: A flotation system that will keep a swamped boat and a specified quantity of the weights of its motor, equipment and passengers floating in an approximately level attitude. Sufficient stability is provided to prevent the swamped craft from capsizing in calm water when one-half of the passengers are evenly distributed at one side of the passenger carrying area and as low as possible in the boat. Level Flotation does not provide a self-righting capability.

leveling, would be in the gunnels the upper section of the bow and in the transom I would think...filling between the stringers under the deck would basically cause it to want to capsize I would think.

More info on calculations:
files.dnr.state.mn.us/education_safety/safety/boatwater/backyardboatbuilders.pdf

US Composites foam:
www.uscomposites.com/foam.html

professor wrote:

vuyosevich

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Floatation can all be calculated.

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Hopefully after this you will not be taking innocent kids out into cold / rough water thinking that 6 pool noodles will keep the boat floating !!!

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Water weighs about 8 LBS / US gallon , so a 5 gallon pail would have trouble holding up a 40 LB cinder block !

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End of coaching !!!

ok, enough.

here a bit of over looked data..take your 40 LB cinder block and weight it under water from a hanging scale everything has buoyancy.

and talking about UV and noodles, no one has even touched on the supper heated environment with the moisture under the deck will also cause them to degrade and add to that the vibration, face it..a pool noodle wasn't designed to be used in a boat hull, maybe in a boat for people as an aux life preserver and to swim with...but not sealed below a deck of a boat.

as you said...End of coaching?

Bwana Don wrote:

More info on calculations:
files.dnr.state.mn.us/education_safety/safety/boatwater/backyardboatbuilders.pdf

US Composites foam:
www.uscomposites.com/foam.html

that a pretty interesting read, page 26,27 and 28 shows about what I was saying about installing in the gunnels and the stern and up in the bow.

This just in: The U.S. economy took a 3.7% jump in the latter half of December 2011, priarily due to the sudden surge in sales of pool noodles and cement blocks.

OK not boat related but water and spray foam related. I worked at Eljer making toilets for some time years back. We had piece called a Patrician with a complex making of parts. Sometimes one would crack inside the trap where you could not see it. We used to fill the voids with expanding foam and them let paint thinner soak a few minutes after it set up to dissolve anything in the trap. It worked and after sitting for months with water in some test bowls we broke them open and the foam was dry. If you have one of these or a Windsor toilet and it has the number 72 stamped on the bottom your truly worked on it. As a side note the Eljer Plant in Ford City is now as flat as the finest parking lot in Beverly Hills because the work went overseas and mexico. PPG moved out years ago. Armstrong County is the asshole of the world as far as job growth but we have a wonderful river valley. In fact job growth here is negative numbers for years.

hum, another thread get's put threw the (heheehehe)

I tend to like the idea of pre-molding a block to fill a void area between the stringers as in the read, and sanding it down to coat with resin and possible a layer of mat. which then some adaption for it could be mounted between the stringers, this allowing the intrusion of water to pass below it and for example a "block" would be sealed, so what ever you used to "fill" the void really wouldn't matter as long as the "block" was sealed to prevent water soaking/intrusion.

deleted..i'm goin with the innertube idea.

ahhhh, Ron, make sure you have a patch kit handy.

Ron, get about 35' of noodles. Split length on one side. Remove your rub rail and install noodles. Thought everybody knew that trick...multi-taskin'

Foam, innertube's and pool noddle's for rub rails...

how about just a real good boat insurance policy and a CG approved life jacket instead...

$378.00's worth. that goes without saying. foam rubrail...looks good too. :

vuyosevich wrote:

$378.00's worth. that goes without saying. foam rubrail...looks good too.

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I LIKE IT!!! Personally ,I think I'll go with Robert's toilet in my boat. **it floats... Kill two turds with one stone Sorry,I just couldn't resist.

Ok,I'm done being silly. Here's what the factory put in my Crestliner. Some type of closed cell foam just laying under the floor.

Jim L wrote:

vuyosevich wrote:

$378.00's worth. that goes without saying. foam rubrail...looks good too.

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I LIKE IT!!! Personally ,I think I'll go with Robert's toilet in my boat. **it floats... Kill two turds with one stone Sorry,I just couldn't resist.

;LMAO

Your way ahead of me Ron. I think the blue looks better than the black on your boat.

I wrapped noodles around my belly last night and hopped into the bathtub and let me tell you something, I never drowned once.

robert-lorigan wrote:

I wrapped noodles around my belly last night and hopped into the bathtub and let me tell you something, I never drowned once.

That's funny!! I don't care who you are

You didn't see my belly. It's huge.

CAT*FIN*k wrote:

Your way ahead of me Ron. I think the blue looks better than the black on your boat.

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I agree cat the blue is sharp, but wouldn't hold up well. it would be great to use it at shows though.

robert-lorigan wrote:

You didn't see my belly. It's huge.

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OUCH!!

thanks olred, I got to thinking about ron's problem where some may not understand his boat has no stringers and the sole of the hull is his floor so he really has a bit of problem.

I saw the answer but...where, ummmmmmmmmm yoga!

www.huggermugger.com/big-blue-block.html



with these he can set in place under the bow and in the stern under the splash well and mount using cement in place-O- rings and zip ties to the inside of the gunnels or under the bow where I have been before.

That is one reason I inserted a little humor. Not everybody has the same circumstances. I cannot pour foam under my deck. My wooden keel would not stay wood to many years. I need the free air flow. I've seen Ron's boat last summer up at John Gibson's house. I've seen how much weight under the deck foam can carry and have had it dripping wet taking it out. My Winner had foam only under the seats. Already in my mind I will have roughly 30% flotation less because I'm not going to put the middle seat back. Under the gunwales runs a 2x4 like piece of wood. After I'm almost through I was thinking about mounting a 1/2 or 3/4 inch sealed plastic pipe as a core for hollow pool noodle. It's way up high from the water line and would be semi-rigid. I am not putting a deck down at all. It's my boat and it will be what I want. I may even just use a tiller motor on it. It has tons of sanding gouges in it from when someone tried their hands a t gel coat removal. It's a shame because everything else is solid.The gel coat that was left is cracked the whole way to fiberglass mat. One solution will never work 100% of the time and we are a collection of ways to do things. Lets work together. IDEAS???

I hear yea robert, giving the read that was posted, using the yoga brick you could stack 3 or 4 together drill a hole through them bolt them together to make the the flotation "cube", the spec sheet I read on them says it is closed cell foam ....But I would still set them in there own sealed involvement with some resin and maybe some mat and then mount them, they make the same brick in cork also...which maybe..maybe a cheaper alternative if it was to be enveloped resin anyways.

which, if genny will let me finish the cobia...I would still go with the structural foam by the read 26,27 and 28 formula for the weight, make a "insert" that would drop into the box stringer area...remove that, fill that with the foam...and seal it and mount it back in between the stringers, could be said to be a bit of an over kill..but giving the condition the cobia was in because of one screw caused the deck to split, the foam that was used became soaked in water...and fuel.

on a side note the backbone of our old canoe was a pvc pipe btw filled with flotation foam and caped, looked at it then with a "WTH where they thinking" just to fined out that using structural grade foam inside the PVC pipe turned that PVC pipe in to something that could take a beating.

i like the idea of using those blue blocks. i could probably place 5 of them in the bow glued together, then glued in a few spots to the floor. would need a mexican to crawl in there though especially now with the center console.

Great under the seat application also.

I have the best idea of all. Just leave the boat on the trailer and sit there drinking beer.

well in ron case, if he does the math from the read, to get an idea on how much to apply, he could just mat and resin each or a couple, figure out where on the gunnels to place them draw out the area..sand lightly and mat and resin them in place.

In theory he could place one brick end to end all the way around the inside of the gunnel all the way around the boat (which would be an over kill), then paint to match the inside and I doubt it would be noticeable.

if the boat did take on water, yes it would sink below the surface, but it would stay level at the surface enabling him to scream for help or get out and walk to shore.